Future of Politics

[Iceberg]

In reading your last post, it seems as though you haven't read Clarke's book. In the book, he is far more complimentary towards Clinton than he was in that speech (I presume it was a speech and not part of his book you were citing, since I do not remember reading that in the book).

As for Clarke removing terrorism references from two Clinton speeches, it was likely to prevent America from going into panic mode, since your nation is far more jittery about stuff like that than most other nations. If things do not seem 100% normal, then the citizens get rattled. If the citizens get rattled, it becomes increasingly difficult for anything to get done.

About PW, I doubt it. They seem to be a "My way of the highway" group, who would shoot anyone who criticised their country.

 

[cableguy]

you couldnt be more wrong about pw... the only folks trying to stifle free speech are from the left... speech codes, political correctness... think what you want, though... the book was a hit piece against President Bush... what i am saying is that clarke is a classic fence sitter, and the side he falls off on is in direct relation to which way political favoritism is going... he would have been a good running mate for sen flipflop...

 

[Iceberg]

you couldnt be more wrong about pw... the only folks trying to stifle free speech are from the left... speech codes, political correctness...

Only on university campuses do I see and hear of stifling of the freedom of speech of those who are contrarians (those who argue against affirmative action, for the right of existence of Israel, and against homosexual marriage except for at the ridiculously crude Bob Jones University).

Everywhere else in America, it is the right-wingers who are stifling dissent. The Fresno Peace Club (or whatever the club's name was) in Fahrenheit 9-11 was infiltrated by FBI agents because of the Patriot Act, which was only due to it being a voice of dissent in the community. Another guy in the film had his door knocked on by the FBI because of otherwise perfectly acceptable criticisms of Dubya was overheard by some paranoid right-wing radical at the local gym. Helen Thomas, the longtime White House reporter, had her seat reassigned and was stuck at the back of the press gallery and has had few, if any, questions for being critical of Bush's policies.

think what you want, though... the book was a hit piece against President Bush... what i am saying is that clarke is a classic fence sitter, and the side he falls off on is in direct relation to which way political favoritism is going... he would have been a good running mate for sen flipflop...

BS. Clarke is a registered Republican and was highly critical of Clinton due to the Lewinsky "scandal," because it distracted the Clinton Administration and caused Congress to reject everything Clinton was trying to get done, especially with respect to terrorism.

He is a man who would never flip-flop, because he stands for what he believes. He is a former military man who would never waver on his support of the US and would do everything in his power to protect the nation (as he attempted to do prior to 9-11, but had his duties reassigned to deal with Iraq and not Al'Qaeda).

For the third time, cableguy, have you read Clarke's book? Please answer this question! If you haven't read the book, these comments you made about him would never have been made, I can guarantee it.

 

[cableguy]

iceberg, i have not read the book... you should also know better than to pose the question... i make a point of avoiding political hit piece books from both camps... what i have are certain quotes of the author... quotes that seem to challenge the point of the book... john mccaine is a registered republican, too... i afford him minimal legitimacy as well... what he believes seems to change with the political winds... he is human, and all humans are fallible... that he was a Clinton appointee should carry some weight here..

regarding speech restrictions, you couldnt be more wrong... do you have any idea what things can NOT, under ANY circumstance, be said in most workplaces??? sexual harrassment and "hate crime" legislation, and subsequent lawsuits that grossly abuse the spirit of those laws, have seen to it that "offensive" speech be outlawed... these speech codes are in place in governmental places of employment as well... until such time as there is a universal agreement that no one has any right or privelege whatsoever to not be offended, this problem will still exist, and it will be because of the pc lefties...

bark elsewhere about the patriot act... i am not its most ardent supporter... IF what you said is true, those are abuses, plain and simple... sadly, as is often the case, the squeaky wheel isnt always telling the truth... peta, now, elf, alf, and the naacp are frequent champions of dishonest causes and fraudulent claims... when the complainants come from these groups, or groups like them, there needs to be a healthy dose of skepticism applied before believing what you want to believe... as things stand, i am aware of a definite abuse of the patriot act that had nothing to do with politics, and everything to do with lost paperwork...

 

[Iceberg]

I'm not going to respond to most of your latest post, since it will be fruitless, since you seem to be unfortunately stuck in your ways. This quote really irritated me, though:

peta, now, elf, alf, and the naacp are frequent champions of dishonest causes and fraudulent claims...

These groups you listed pales in comparison to the one you neglected to name, the NRA, which propagates lies about the Second Amendment, allowing arms to be in the hands of criminals without much of a background check; allowing law-abiding citizens to possess firearms at their residences, which, in the event of a break-in, leads to a death ratio of 38-1 (resident-suspect); and leads to children picking up their parents' guns and playing with them, accidentally killing them or their siblings, parents, or friends. And then, there's the whole school and workplace shooting sprees that seem to be an almost daily occurrence.

I'd even venture to call the NRA a terrorist organisation of infinite proportions compared to what the FBI is calling ELF and ALF, since no lives have ever been lost in an ELF or and ALF action, while thousands, even millions of lives have been needlessly and senselessly taken as a result of NRA infiltration into government.

 

[Texan]

Iceberg.......

hell its not even worth the effort.

 

[Iceberg]

An excellent site with stuff on the Bolton nomination:

http://www.mahablog.com/

 

[Texan]

Who cares about Bolton, he is quailified for the job.

We should be concerned with the comments of Dick Durbin on the senate floor. This man should be ran out of the senate.

http://washingtontimes.com/national/20050621-121514-9288r.htm

 

[cableguy]

guns werent considered a problem by ANYONE until the age of the hippy... once upon a time, in a more peaceful and gentle past, as recently as 30 or so years ago, there were no such things as "anti-gun" laws... if you wanted to buy one, you bought it... if you wanted to carry it around, you did so, and judging by history, did so responsibly... if you insist on badmouthing the nra and calling them a terrorist organization, which is laughable, perhaps you should consider referring to aaa as an even worse offender... after all, they promote the use of--*GASP*--cars...

tex, you are absolutely right on bolton... his only sin is loving his country, and wanting to stand up for it, even if doing so is unpopular internationally... last i checked, that is what representatives of any nation are SUPPPOSED to do... the good news is that we are one step closer to disallowing the fake filibuster for advise and consent situations...

 

[Supafly]

"a prisoner being held at the naval base in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, who was chained to the floor and subjected to loud rap music. The air conditioner was alternately turned very high so that the terror suspect was "shaking with cold" or turned off so the temperature in his cell was "well over 100 degrees."



"The SS used the hydro-cyanic acid compound "Cyclone B" which evaporated at body
temperature in a hermetically sealed room and led to death from suffocation within a very short time."



Oh my god! Durbin's right I never realized how similar the two are.

 

[cableguy]

someone suggested on some radio show i was listening to that dick durbin change his name to dick TURBAN...

oh, the prisoners there eat better than our average soldier, have better (cooler in the day, not deathly cold at night) temperatures than our soldiers in iraq face daily... music and discomfort based on temperature... i shudder at the thought... what horrors will these poor terrorists be subjected to next??

 

[Iceberg]

someone suggested on some radio show i was listening to that dick durbin change his name to dick TURBAN...

That shows how few brains those who listen to that radio show have. It was probably some fat Rush Limbaugh-like idiot who hosts the show, which is listened to by millions of other fools who don't know they're being lied to every day of the week by the host.

 

[Supafly]

Being mean spirited won't help you make your point.

Seriously though, what is your problem? Is Canada really that boring? You have nothing better to due than criticize the US.

Thats the reason why the liberals will never get anywhere. All they do is whine and complain about how everyone else is wrong or how everyone else is an idiot. I hate to break it to you but the people have spoken................

 

[thewonderdog]

I didn't get to see it, but I heard Jon Stewart did a comparison of speeches by FDR, Truman and JFK and compare the positive words ("ask not what you country can do for you, but what you can do for your country" and " you have nothing to fear but fear itself") to the words of the modern day Democrats. It is amazing to hear how the tone has changed since these men were in the White House.

 

[cableguy]

wonderdog, there is a certain retired senator from georgia who has been echoing those sentiments for years... former senator zell miller.. "a national party no more" and "a deficit of decency" are books on my to-read list...

 

[Iceberg]

A bit of a humour break (from author or authors unknown):

Points to ponder...

COWS:

Is it just me, or does anyone else find it amazing that our government can track a cow born in Canada almost three years ago, right to the stall where she sleeps in the state of Washington, and they tracked her calves to their stalls. But they are unable to locate 11 million illegal aliens wandering around our country. Maybe we should give them all a cow.

CONSTITUTION:

They keep talking about drafting a Constitution for Iraq. Why don't we just give them ours? It was written by a lot of really smart guys, it's worked for over 200 years and we're not using it anymore.

TEN COMMANDMENTS:

The real reason that we can't have the Ten Commandments in a Courthouse? You cannot post "Thou Shalt Not Steal," "Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery" and "Thou Shall Not Lie" in a building full of lawyers, judges and politicians...It creates a hostile work environment.

And Last but not least..... George Carlin said it best about Martha Stewart .. "Boy, I feel a lot safer now that she's behind bars. O.J. Simpson and Kobe Bryant are still walking around; Osama Bin Laden too, but they take the one woman in America willing to cook, clean, and work in the yard, and haul her ass off to jail."

 

[mindido]

Did anyone else happen to catch this weekends "Capital Gang" on CNN where Bob Novak, of all people, admitted that Washington is now almost totally corrupt. They were discussing the huge influx of lobbyists into DC since the bush admin. began.

More ammo that the two party system in this country is a sham.

 

[Texan]

A bit of a humour break (from author or authors unknown):

Points to ponder...

COWS:

Is it just me, or does anyone else find it amazing that our government can track a cow born in Canada almost three years ago, right to the stall where she sleeps in the state of Washington, and they tracked her calves to their stalls. But they are unable to locate 11 million illegal aliens wandering around our country. Maybe we should give them all a cow.

Yeah and ABC did and interview with Bin Laden, yet Bill Clinton was unable to locate him. Then when he got lucky, he failed to pull the trigger.


DC has always been corrupt, why do you think it took Matt Drudge to break the oval blow job story when newsweek sat on it.

 

[mindido]

Tex,

"Yeah and ABC did and interview with Bin Laden, yet Bill Clinton was unable to locate him."

Yep and Porter Goss says we basically know where Bin Laden is now, why aren't we going after him immediately?

"DC has always been corrupt,"

And that makes it right?

 

[Supafly]

I think his point was that they're all corrupt, Dems and Reps. But the Dems seem to forget that when there's a Republican in office.


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